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	title of this thread your message Modernica was indeed producing the knockoff ESU for quite some time before HM contracted them. In fact, I bought the Modernica version a few years before the reintroduction, because frankly, they were about the only ones producing them. Quite surprisingly, Modernica made both HM tagged, and Modernica tagged pieces simultaneously. That's sort of the crux of my legit v. non-legit argument. The label was pretty much the only difference at that point. I'm not sure how they managed that politically, but I do know that when I talked to Eames Demetrios in 2000, he was not at all happy with the HM / Modernica relationship. Perhaps the simultaneous production was the cause of it. I didn't press him on it, and it was right around that time that the relationship was severed. Luc, First I do apologize for my rather abrupt entry into the conversation. I meant no offense. Just wanted to add my 2 cents to a spirited debate. You are correct about HM enforcing stricter construction guidelines on Modernica. Before the partnership, it was pretty much a custom shop. You ordered a size, and picked out every single panel and option. Crazy way to manufacture anything. Re. the fiberglass chairs. Yes, the Eames' might have eventually altered the materials, but 21 years after Ray's death, it's all hypothetical. However, we can be pretty darn certain that the Eames' would NOT have tried to make the polypropylene emulate its fiberglass predecessor, as Vitra has done with the surface texture. One thing that the they were fanatical about was allowing materials express their own nature. Also, the example of using plastic for the EA127 is a bit specious. It wasn't a replacement for the DCM; just an additional model in the line. The Vitra armshell is meant to be the current incarnation of the original DAR. Re. the clocks, yes, Irving Harper claims the design duty for most of them. But with the exception of some really awful post-modernist clocks that Howard Miller produced, none of them actually had George's name on them anyway (and IMHO, he really shouldn't have... dreadful things). That said, if you own the consultancy, it's generally your name that gets attached to the product. associated web images (optional) associated web link (optional) your email your password create a forums account \| you forgot your password?