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14-Jul-03 |
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bob manfreddo
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14-Jul-03 |
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TIPTOE THROUGH THE TULIPS, BOB
Bob, I was the top EBAY bidder on what was to be a Knoll Sarrinen tulip table. What arrived was a second-rate, at best copy from White on White. The base isn't the correct size, and the marble top is rough. I filed complaints with EBAY, and sought councel. In the meantime I donated the table to charity , and replaced it with the Knoll piece. With the amount of modern classics that I have in my home, in all likelyhood, even a purest probably never would even have noticed. But I noticed everytime I looked at the thing. I learned a lesson. And I moved on. You should get familiar with the Knoll piece before looking at the knock-offs. The differences may sway your decision.
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14-Jul-03 |
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EYE
some have it many D O N T .what i dont understand is this halfway stuff/people.if you cant tell why do you care just a little.ebay is full of misattribution/fakes.sp.alot seem not to know and say so.tulip range is a heavily knocked off line since its inception.
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lol
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14-Jul-03 |
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EYE ON SOMETHING ELSE
Sweetie pie, Put down the hot dog and the diet rite. What in the world are you trying to say? I've tried to decipher, but have had little luck. Responce?
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15-Jul-03 |
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Knoll Europe sub-contracts the tulip table to the original specifications in Italy at the same factories that the copies are made (to the same specifications)thus they are identical. Of course dead cheap stuff made in far east use poorer materials . The ones made in europe are exactly the same. I got two of them one from knoll and one from Alivar . They are exactly the same only alivar has a better cut of marble !
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15-Jul-03 |
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MISSY respon C e
I ADMIT I CANT SPELL /BUT REALLY.I GUESS YOU CANT DECIPHER A DICTIONARY.TRANSPOSING S AND C IS A SIGN OF ILL LET YOU GUESS.
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B/J
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15-Jul-03 |
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15-Jul-03 |
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alivar
How can i get in touch with alivar? do they have a website?
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15-Jul-03 |
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sure
www.alivar.com
i've just made up my mind and decided to buy an alivar barcellona. Have a look at alivar contract section: if Czech Republic chose Alivar (and not Knoll) to furnish Villa Tugendhatit with reproductions of the original furniture by Mies, Alivar stuff must not be so bad indeed.
Ciao
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Massimiliano
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16-Jul-03 |
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SURE...ANOTHER BARCELONAZERCONIA!!!
Well, I just took a peek at Alivor's version of the Barcelona chair on their website. All looked good until I read the dreaded "chrome plated" word. It looks to be about the same quality as Design w/in Reach. Knoll offers the best version of this chair, period. I would probably give up my refrigerator before I'd part with my barcelona chair/otto. I use the term "Barcelonazerconia" for anything less than the Knoll piece.
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16-Jul-03 |
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go the repro
I've got a saarinen table w/marble top reproduction. It's not knoll, but to be honest, only an extreme design geek would be able to tell. It's a marble top and an aluminum base just like knoll, without the knoll price tag. I use it everyday without worrying about scratching it because it hasn't cost me a small fortune.
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Raymond Hudson
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16-Jul-03 |
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Or you could just wait for Knoll's annual sale....I think its just over 40% off, then the price comes a bit closer to the knock-off's.
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17-Jul-03 |
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FORGO THE REPRO
A better choice might have been to purchase one of the many used Knoll tulip tables off of EBAY. The $$$ probably would have been about the same, and hopefully the piece will have a few "fleabites and bruises" to show that it has been put to use. Saarinen would be so proud.
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20-Jul-03 |
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even the knoll saarinen tables have changes in the shape of the pedestal base over the years. if you look at the present day knoll table base, it differs from the original piece of the late 50's so therefore is not true to the designers original vision. To be honest, i've seen truer reproductions from other manufacturers and a whole lot cheaper as well. I really don't know how knoll justifies it's prices.
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Gregory Harris
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24-Jul-03 |
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its true , i got knoll one from my granmother and i bought a new one to have a pair as night tables and to my big suprise , the new one wasnt the same as the old one. most of the dimensions were different. Are new knoll ones bad copies too ?
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24-Jul-03 |
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Dimensions
It is true that some of the non-knoll reproductions are truer to saarinen's original design than knoll. I don't know why. What i have noticed is that the original saarinen tulip base has a thinner while today's knoll repro is quite chunky looking.
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Terence Vickers
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24-Jul-03 |
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Yeah, there are tons of this table on Knockoff Ave. Many we can veiw online. But how can you tell of any quality without seeing the goods with your peepers? For this reason I only purchase Knoll and Herman Miller modern classics. I know that the quality will be intact. And if need for customer service should come about, or a replacement part needed, they will be there. You get what you pay for.
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24-Jul-03 |
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replacement part?
what kind of replacement part could you possibly need with a table given that it's ... well ... a table top and a base. hmmm, i guess when you pay thousands of dollars for a knoll they have to give you something more than just a table. Oh, and a little sticker underneath that says 'knoll'.
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25-Jul-03 |
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B E W A R E
I HAVE A ROLL OF KNOLL STICKERS.SO LEARN YOUR FORMS.
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PETEY
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25-Jul-03 |
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TOUGH BREAK
Well...I picked the Knoll tulip table up by the marble top and it broke! So I had to order a new top. It was delivered within weeks. I won't do that again!
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25-Jul-03 |
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YOU ARE A SCUMBAG PETE!!!
Well I guess now we all know that ole Pete doesn't corner the market on morality. His Knoll label practice is pure deception. I have known former business partners and former friends that have engaged in similar activity in the way they choose to do business. The funny thing is ...the scumbag always get his just deserts. I sure Pete has been in many a situation throughout life where Pete has ended up looking like a complete fool. So, go ahead and play your game...If you burn me, I'll bury you in legal limbo and put the proper label back on you. Wanna play? I'm ready for ya ,Pete.
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26-Jul-03 |
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Knoll puts its label stickers on others products (jamaica stool of company Amat3) why shouldnt others put the "immoral" sticker on furniture that closer to the original than the knoll copy...
confused ?
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26-Jul-03 |
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STICKER THIS PAL!!!
Boy oh boy, you and Pete should hook up. Your comment about Knoll sticker on Amat products must be legal. I'm sure both Knoll and Amat have addressed this issue in the past. What Pete is doing is downright fraud. Knoll is one of the most ethical manufactures I have delt with. If they say Amats product is worthy of their label, so be it. But it will be a COLD DAY IN HELL when I would trust Pete's judgement as to whether or not a piece was worthy enough to proudly display the Knoll label. We are talking about two different means of doing business. I'll stick with Knoll.
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26-Jul-03 |
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PETEY
IF P. KNOWS ZILCH/ DONT YOU KNOW for SURE THE STICKERS ARE NOT THE REAL THING.ALSO HE/SHE DOES NOT SAY ANYTHING OTHER THAN THEY HAVE A ROLL OF STICKERS.
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F.S.K.B.
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26-Jul-03 |
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POOR PETEY
Well lets hear from Petey? What are your plans for the Knoll labels?
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26-Jul-03 |
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p.
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26-Jul-03 |
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The argument
the saarinen table design is very simple which makes it easy to reproduce. I guess with other pieces like an eames chair/ottoman - it becomes a lot easier to spot a dodgy reproduction. At the end of the day - the saarinen table is just a round slab of marble or laminate with a powder coated aliminium base. Whether it's knoll or whoever - it's still going to be aliminium and marble. I think that if it looks good and is half the price (or more) of a knoll - then buy it. I rekon it would take one hell of a design nerd to tell the difference, but then would you really want to have dinner with someone like that.
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Rachael Lever
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26-Jul-03 |
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One other thing
I've just stuck a knoll sticker to my ass and it's suddenly looking a lot better than it used to. It just goes to show doesn't it.
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26-Jul-03 |
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you say NERD i say VISUAL LITERATE
SOMEONE STATED -GOD IS IS IN THE DETAILS/TO THE STATUS only PERSON A FAKE IS PASSABLE/A DETAIL ORIENTED DESIGN ADDICT MAKES DISTINCTIONS/ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL BUT not ALL DESIGNS ARE.A KNOCK OFF IS NOUTHING/ A HALF MEASURE.
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A Z U R E C H I C K E N
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26-Jul-03 |
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Knock offs
everything is a knock off - it's just
that some knock-off's are better
than others. I agree, god is in the details and if you analyse something long enough, you will see those hidden details.
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Jamal-Nenirras Llonk
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27-Jul-03 |
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repro
make your own saarinen!
get a round bit of marble cut
and create a mould for the aluminium base.
Then design your own sticker to go underneath it!
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28-Jul-03 |
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Where can I find this?
This knockoff sounds too good to be true. Raymond where on earth did you find this fabulous deal?
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01-Aug-03 |
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knoll
just because your table is knoll - doesn't mean it's great quality. Trust me, both knoll and other repro's have the same wear and tear problems over time. The paint on the base scratches, the marble can crack etc.. etc... because they are both made of the same materials.
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01-Aug-03 |
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A MAJOR ASPECT
QUALITY WEARS WELL/CHEAP STUFF JUST DEGRADES.THE MONA LISA CAN RIP.
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jon
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01-Aug-03 |
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I go with Knoll every time.
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Spinky
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03-Aug-03 |
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And for all of you still leaving in ingnorance.....
Mona Lisa is a Prototype , the Knoll saarinen table is a re-production , even the knoll one .
Sorry guys but your problem can be solved with a common dictionary.
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04-Aug-03 |
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knoll are having a laugh everytime someone buys a saarinen table. How much can a round slab of marble and a cast aliminium base be worth anyway. Maybe 5 percent of the purchase price i'd say.
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05-Aug-03 |
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NAMES MEAN SOMETHING
KNOLL/ says plenty and has for MANY years. QUALITY RARELY COMES CHEAP. BUY LESS BUY BETTER. KNOLL HAS BEEN SHOWN AT THE LOUVRE THAT ALONE S A Y S PLENTY.
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florence
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07-Oct-03 |
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ITS MY DESIGN
I licence knoll to produce it.you know better i think not.thank you florence
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mies
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15-Oct-03 |
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15-Oct-03 |
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Tips for buyers
Here are tips for buyers who want tulip marble table:
1) Knoll version has coating on top to prevent water marks. Knock off from White on white doesn't.
2) Knoll has pure white marble top as more costly version. It is so beautiful. Knock off does not offer pure white marble top.
3) Aluminum base finishing of Knoll version has smooth, subtle shine. Knock off version has high gross shine. To me, subtle shine of Knoll version looks more precious.
4) Under base of Knoll version has embossed with writing reads "Knoll International" (this is hard to read sometimes beacause of thick coating. you will figure it out). Sometimes, it is embossed with whole bunch of series of numbers.
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15-Oct-03 |
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Tips on Barcelona chair
Here are tips for buying Barcelona chairs:
1) Knoll version offers single piece of stainless steel base. (I mean single piece!). Knock off version has a joint hidden under the very first leather strap on each side of back. DWR has the joint. White on white has the joint. Single piece of stainless steel will last a life time or two.
2) Knoll version offers stainless steel base. White on white version offers chrome plated metal.
3) Back and seat cusion of Knoll version are much heavier than Knock off. It is beacause Knoll version offers higher grade of foam cusion. It lasts 20 to 30 years of use.
I will post more tips of Barcelona chair when I go to find out more on knock off version at DWR store and at White.
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15-Oct-03 |
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thank you
are you actually going to see the items thats great/you have sharp a eye.
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15-Oct-03 |
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I also have a sharp eye. This, my friend is what seperates the girl scout from the brownie. Don't feel bad, the majority of all folk are myoptic like yourself.
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M
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16-Oct-03 |
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WE NEED MORE MENTAL F A R T S LIKE THAT LAST ONE WE REALLY REALLY DO.
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16-Oct-03 |
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16-Oct-03 |
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Any Ideas?
I am looking for an original 60's tulip dining table base.
Are there any distinct knoll markings on the base of the table not the top? How can I tell if it's Knoll other than it is made from cast aluminum and the shape?
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Joty
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16-Oct-03 |
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Knoll tulip base
Joty
Knoll tulip base has smooth, subtle shine. Knock off has high grossy finish. Knoll base has stamp under it. Sometimes, they are "Knoll International", sometimes, they are series of numbers. Knock off has no mark. Overall, Knoll base has nicer finish and shape.
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16-Oct-03 |
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Joty
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16-Oct-03 |
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Repro Advice
I know that buying repros is risky, but the Knoll is too pricey for me. Anyone have any suggestions?
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Geller
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16-Oct-03 |
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LOOK IN TOP RIGHT HAND CORNER TYPE IN KNOLL REPRO VS.KNOLL LOTS OF ADVICE ON THIS TOPIC.
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03-Nov-03 |
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tulip reproductions
In this discussion people have mentioned access to reproductions, such as on the Alivar site. I have been unable to locate this table. Is it on the Alivar site, or on other sites? Please list sites with recommendations.
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30-Nov-03 |
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Saarinen for Knoll Tulip Table
Hiya Guys, im new here, Ive just purchased a lovely six seater glass top, aluminium base table. Its massive and wont fit in my london flat. Any offers? Thanks
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30-Nov-03 |
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29-Jun-04 |
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searching for table
frustrated in so cal. please let me know where I can find a repro of the saarinen inspired knoll white round tulip chair and table. Much thanks.
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29-Jun-04 |
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Try surrounding.com
Good quality. Made in Italy. Also eurofurniture.com offers the set though they are more expensive than surrounding.com, at least the chairs.
I bought the table from eurofurniture.com and the chairs for surrounding.com. Good luck
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22-Jul-04 |
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Hi Folks!
Similar to...
Hi Folks!
Similar to Richard's, my wife and I have a glass top/stainless steel base Saarinen style table with six tulip chairs in grey lucite/stainless steel which all seem to be sixties vintage. Can anyone tell us anything about them - specifically their potential value?
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03-Aug-04 |
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21-Nov-04 |
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Saarinen table and chairs
hi-
I have a Saarinen table and 4 chairs (white) from Burke, Inc., Dallas Texas.
I have seen a wide range of prices, and do not know what to charge for them. My parents bought it new around 1963 from a designer's trade mart. Have no idea if that makes it more valuable or not. Anyone know?
Thanks for the help.
Cindy
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02-Dec-07 |
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knoll table
i have a burke base that a buddy gave me in cast aluminum and my occupation is in granite/marble fabrication so naturally i made a 47" circle top with knife edge out of granite as opposed to marble because of wear and tear I am a 27 male and play cards/have buddies over who would well be hard on marble all my interactions with marble have been unsatisfactory ie staining, chipping etc but the problem i am haiving is that the base is flexing in the middle causing a sort of bounce curious if any one has any solutions as to stablize the situation. I really like the look with four eames armshells. and the price was a no brainer thanks for any feed back cory
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02-Dec-07 |
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flexing in the middle causing...
flexing in the middle causing a sort of bounce
does this mean you are having buckling on the stand? or is this just flaking paint off ?
if it buckling it is cause
the granite is too heavy for the base, would be my guess, if is flaking have it stripped and powdercoated and it will be perfect,
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03-Dec-07 |
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Real Knoll vs....
A couple of points (maybe mentioned before, but here goes).
The original vintage Knoll - with the label (either big K or red and white Knoll label) is the best way to be sure you're getting a real Knoll. The original white base was matted and not glossy. The current Knoll Saarinen's are shiny glossy and looks a bit like plastic.
There were so many vintage knockoffs (Burke, etc.) at the time, that I wouldn't go for any Saarinen Tulips unless you're sure they have the proper Knoll label.
Now....I bought a Saarinen ashstand from Bauhaus 2 Your House earlier this year, and their 'knockoffs' come from Italy. All of Knoll's current shiny base Saarinen's come from Italy too....I bet the Bauhaus ones come from the same factory. (I WAS able to order the base in a matte finish, but the darn ashstand did not come with the screen.)
You can safely buy old Saarinen tulip pieces on eBay IF you see the original label or remnants of the label clearly shown in the photographs.
http://www.bauhaus2yourhouse.com/
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18-Feb-09 |
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Sarrinen tulip table
Hi, I love the Saarinen tulip table (white laminate). I am looking for a high quality reproduction at a reasonable price. Any websites that you can recommend? Thanks!
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19-Feb-09 |
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beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep......
beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep... beep beeep beeep beeep beeep beeep beep beeep
It's alive...over a year later and this thread is alive.
fm
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